HID driving light failure - 4 times in 2 months. What's going on?

[r4ndll Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close r4ndll]

Wondering if any of the PP electrical illuminati can shed some light (pun intended) on my issue. Is it bad product or dodgy install? Electrics are a dark art to me.

I had a set of HID Bushranger driving lights professionally installed mid-sept. (couldn't go past the deal) but since then, the right spot has failed 3 times. To be fair the guys who did it have replaced bulb and ballast without question each time, but its getting ridiculous and it is always the same light that goes.

I'm at the point where I say give me something else, or rip it all out and give me my money back. I'd like some 'discussion ammunition' before I call them.

Is it possible they've stuffed up the installation/wiring and that's causing some issue or is the product just dodgy?

I have noticed that they have cable tied part of the right ballast assembly to the insulated airconditioner tube that runs across the front of the air conditioner cooler. Is it possible that's causing some issue? Overheating or cooling it? - not sure if that pipe gets hot or cold

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

Where it's cable tied won't cause an issue. Given that it's the right one everytime and it has been replaced and not repaired it tends to lean towards a wiring fault.

I'm going to presume that they share a common 12V but it's quite possible they have independant grounding locations. If so, my train of thought would say, thats the problem. I have this a number of times in HIDs. They earth poorly and consequently develop a flicker on startup (striking voltage is MUCH higher than running) HIDs need a VERY solid earth point for that initial strike and often, a simple self tapper into painted metal is NOT enough.

Myself personally do one of two things. I either run the earth to a nearby, unpainted bolt (often the bolt that mounts a relay to the sidewall) or I will sand back some metal, use two self tappers and then throw a quick shot of paint over it to seal it off from the weather.

I think they need to inspect for voltage drop at each lamp under load. No point checking it with the light disconnected or switched off...light needs to be on or getting switched on.

Hope I've shedded some light on the subject.... pun DEFINITELY intended

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During the install, did they cut any wires in the loom? I assume that they haven't. I've heard that the looms should never be touched for HIDs.

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

For HIDs, the only reason to go near the factory loom will be to take a high beam trigger to switch the relay. Won't affect the running of the HIDs at all.

[LeighW Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close LeighW]

First off, the aircon tube is probably alloy, therefore I personally would not cable tie any weight to it.

Second, the insulated tube is most likely the cool side of the plumbing but might still get warm.

The first thing we need to know is is it the globe, the ballast or both is failing? You say they have swapped the ballast and the globe so that kind of eliminates them, did they swap out the cabling and plugs?

Try swapping the good ballast and globe with the troublesome unit, if it also then blows but the other side remains ok you have narrowed it down to the wiring on the right side or fittings.

Could the plug for instance be flashing over, could water be getting into the connections etc.

Has excessive force been used when the globes were installed and damaged the end seal.

And unfortunatley the old rule, if there cheap and a good buy there still cheap!

Leigh

[r4ndll Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close r4ndll]

Where it's cable tied won't cause an issue. Given that it's the right one everytime and it has been replaced and not repaired it tends to lean towards a wiring fault.

I'm going to presume that they share a common 12V but it's quite possible they have independant grounding locations. If so, my train of thought would say, thats the problem. I have this a number of times in HIDs. They earth poorly and consequently develop a flicker on startup (striking voltage is MUCH higher than running) HIDs need a VERY solid earth point for that initial strike and often, a simple self tapper into painted metal is NOT enough.

Myself personally do one of two things. I either run the earth to a nearby, unpainted bolt (often the bolt that mounts a relay to the sidewall) or I will sand back some metal, use two self tappers and then throw a quick shot of paint over it to seal it off from the weather.

I think they need to inspect for voltage drop at each lamp under load. No point checking it with the light disconnected or switched off...light needs to be on or getting switched on.

Hope I've shedded some light on the subject.... pun DEFINITELY intended

Thanks for the quick responses. I'll pass on your suggestion - Definitely noticed a flicker on start up on that right light since new. They did say that there was a bad batch that went through from the manufactured but the last swap was meant to be a new ballast and bulb from an unaffected batch. Not sure if that's just salesspeak though.

During the install, did they cut any wires in the loom? I assume that they haven't. I've heard that the looms should never be touched for HIDs.

Good question that I can't answer. I'll check tonight, but I didn't notice any obvious cuts when I looked it over originally

[r4ndll Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close r4ndll]

First off, the aircon tube is probably alloy, therefore I personally would not cable tie any weight to it. Second, the insulated tube is most likely the cool side of the plumbing but might still get warm. The first thing we need to know is is it the globe, the ballast or both is failing? You say they have swapped the ballast and the globe so that kind of eliminates them, did they swap out the cabling and plugs? Try swapping the good ballast and globe with the troublesome unit, if it also then blows but the other side remains ok you have narrowed it down to the wiring on the right side or fittings. Could the plug for instance be flashing over, could water be getting into the connections etc. Leigh Is it possible that excess force has been used when the bulbs have been inserted and damaged the end seal on the globe?

The ballast is fixed to the frame, just the high votage box that is cable tied. I'm not that comfortable with it being there myself.

I watched them do the first swap and they only swapped the ballasts over and it was definitley dead. (Left worked on right). They swapped them back, popped a new ballast on and away I went. No plugs, bulbs, or anything changed. The last time (2 weeks ago) was supposed to be a new globe and ballast, but I didn't watch them do it.

I never tried swapping them over myself. I might give that a go and see what happens. (Honestly, I am really scared of mucking around with anything electrical - I electrocuted myself as an 8 year old trying to get a tape player with no plug to work by sticking the bare wires into a wall socket. Had a numb hand for ages )

[LeighW Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close LeighW]

RanJ is right about the earthing, the bulbs have several stages of start, high volts to strike then they have to stabilise, then they have a run voltage etc, a poor earth could cause the bulb to be damaged. But I wouldn't not have thought the ballast would be but will stand corrected.

Flickering is a defiant indication the lamp is not happy, either the lamp is leaking, the ballast is not working correctly or the bulb has an internal fault.

As long as the lights have been off for a few minutes you should be safe, don't play with them when there on else you might get a nasty surprise!

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

Typically the bulb doesn't care about the ramification of poor earthing, if it manages to strike at lower voltages, it will and be done with it. Given the history I'm happy to put my money on it being the ballasts failing and that the bulbs are fine. Obviously the question is why. If they've been wired in the unofficial yet accepted way I would say earthing. After that, who knows.

If you need to touch the bulb thats fine, as Leigh mentioned, not when they are one, given them a few minutes to cool down and I don't know how much of a requirement it is but I always wipe them down with an alcohol after touching the glass to get my oils off the glass.

[r4ndll Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close r4ndll]

Thanks for you input everyone.

Update: Manufacturer said they had a batch of bad ballasts but didn't know where in the production run it was. So they apparently tested and sent out a new one which was fitted on the weekend.

Before the swap, they flicked them on to test. Afterwards the working light's ballast was cool to the touch and the failed light's was almost too hot to handle. Not sure if that means anything, but interesting anyway.

They had also been earthed with a zinc bolt to a painted bracket holding the relay. Going off the above advice, that's been changed too. Fingers crossed and we will see how long it lasts. Otherwise they're coming out and being replaced.

[RanJ Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close RanJ]

Before the swap, they flicked them on to test. Afterwards the working light's ballast was cool to the touch and the failed light's was almost too hot to handle. Not sure if that means anything, but interesting anyway.

Means a lot, means the ballast is doing something goofy and the bulb is trying to arc but it just ain't happening.