Trailer Option suggestions

[McBAIN Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close McBAIN]

On the back of the GTG and realising how much stuff I took vs how much space I had to accomodate it I'm moving into Camper Trailer territory.

That said, I've just spent $800 on a Blackwolf Twin Turbo tent that has been used a grand total of once (or three times if you count the setup and packdowns of the GTG) so i'm not after the whole setup from day one until i get a bit more value out of the tent, just going for the space to start with and will build it up with time, but if there's something that has structural impact on the trailer then i've added it to start with.

So far, i've got a 7x4 semi offroad setup with 2x Jerry Can, 1 x 4.5Kg Gas, side opening tailgate, extended drawbar, vertical spare wheel, toolbox, stabiliser legs, full length side steps and a tonnaue cover.

There are two options i'm undecided on.

Mechanical override brakes for $700 (or electrical for $800)
Trigg polyblock Hitch for $340 or Hyland Hitch for $410

My question to you seasoned trailer/camper trailer draggers.... considering it won't have a tent on it at this stage, the trailer weighs in at around 350kg unloaded. strap in my gear, and some water and gas i would probably be heading towards 600kg... so i don't think weight is an issue.. yet.. quote is $700 to do it now or $1000-1200 to add it later. (i.e. in a few years when i get the tent added). at what point do i want brakes? make things easier in sand/soft dirt etc? stop trailer misbehaving under heavy braking? and would you go mechanical or electrical? seems like plenty of people in both camps!

Second Questions is the hitch, it comes with a quick release by default. i've seen a fair few "it's fine for most things" comments in other forums and i don't anticipate dragging it to the cape next week. Considering the places i would take it i.e. in and out of cruiser park, to and from the SA 2012 GTG etc... do i need to add a hard core hitch from the outset? What sort of angles do you get out of standard before you would want the 360 degree flex, what are the pro's and cons and those of you that have something other than standard, did you add it at the outset or upgrade later? Trailer guy is suggesting that it's a major job to change it over as they need to cut the old one off and weld on new plates for the difference. i've seen a few places that sell them separately so i'm not convinced it's such a hassle if i want to add later..

I'm not overly keen on the idea of having to undo the trailer ball to change trailer (i have a normal trailer as well, which is unappealing side of the Trigg hitch, the hyland looks good with a normalish connection.. but could be overkill....

appreciate your input!

[MUMSRIG Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close MUMSRIG]

Well.... Brakes are always handy... However, our camper trailer is not fitted with any and we were fully loaded (to the hilt) for our month excersion over east and I really didn't find a spot where I thought we would have benefited from the extra expense of fitting them... and that included some spirited braking due to Emu's and Kangaroos etc.

I think the times where they would be really handy is in steep decents etc. Heading over a drop off in gravel where the trailer can assist you in braking. So for the expense on a not so heavy trailer you would have to be hard pressed to install them IMO... However... in saying that, any braking capability is better than none!

As far as a Trigg or Tregg etc goes... Takes bugger all time to swap the ball and hitch over if required. I have to do the same thing when I want to use the normal trailer.

Not only does it offer better entry and exit angles but it also allows for more room under you tailgate if you wish to open it with the trailer attached. Little expense and a fair benefit..

Mitch

[croozr Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close croozr]

With a all up weight of 600kg you'll be fine 750kg is the legal limit, if you have room you will end up using it and 750 comes around very fast!

Override have some benifits - easy to use with all vehicles no brake controler required
- easy to use with discs = very low maintainace best for mud and dust

Electric - very good control - work in reverse - easy to reverse on tracks without working against you - independant operations control sway

Hyland or DO35 are the best for field hooking up - polyblock hitches are hard work and very high risk of finger jambing - sticks are good for holding the block level while backing up leaving the fingers out of the area!

Matthew

[AJ120 Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close AJ120]

Hi matt,

I would go the electric brakes, I put mechanical overrides on my trailer and I plan to change to electric, simply for controlled braking on steep decents. Legally if you are under 750kg you don't need brakes however if your trailer weighs 350kg to start it wont take long to put 400kg in it, especially if you start to look at water tanks and batteries down the track, once you put a tent top on; being under 750kg is virtually unheard of.

I am not familar with the hyland hitch, I have the Trigg coupling which is great, it will do everything you ever need it to in any off road situation, not a big job to swap from the ball to the poly block coupling considering you wont be swapping them every other day. You could consider swapping you hitch on your other trailer to a poly block so they are both the same, I have this on my hydraulic tip trailer and it is great excuse as to why I can't lend it to every Tom dick and harry tha wants to borrow it.

You haven't mentioned springs, I would not use slipper springs on an off road trailer, go the eye to eye springs.

Not surprised to see you going the traile route, that was a pretty comples packing job you were doing at the GTG.

Looking forward to catching up at the GTG in South Oz.

Cheers Andrew

[seenthelight Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close seenthelight]

If you have brakes fitted when the trailer is new , you can rego it as a 2000kg trailer,
no brakes it is 750kg trailer( my 7x4 is 480kg so with no brakes it could carry 270kg)
(with brakes it can carry 1520kg)
As for the hitch go to a trailer manufacture and try to hitch it on your car (try before you buy)
Geoff

[Jeffers Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Jeffers]

Hi McBain,
I suggest you check out Vehicle Components at Geebung (Nth Brisbane) for your Hitch. The guys there manufacture special 4X4 trailer components and are tested every year with a long distance gruelling off road trip.
Cheers,
Jeff.

[Kevin Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Kevin]

What is the ATM of the trailer with brakes? If you are going to multi-use the trailer (not a dedicated camping trailer) then the additional capacity that you might legally have could be beneficial, particularly if you are into landscaping etc. (Dirt is heavy stuff, around 2tonne/cubic meter).

As for electrical vs override, I have experienced override brakes towing a mates 1.5ton boat trailer, and I much prefer the control you have with electrics, which I have on my camper. With a proportional brake controller, such as a Prodigy, you can adjust the amount of brake force on the fly, such as when changing from bitumen to gravel, or for different load levels.

As for the coupling, I use two tow ball mounts, the genuine toyota one with a 50mm ball and a HR one with the AT35 coupling. My reason for going that way was the AT35 coupling has tabs that keep it straight on the rectangular HR TBM, but aren't as effective on the OEM TBM. When I go camping with the tinny on the camper, I also have a fold up boat trailer which has a ball mount. I carry a pair of big ring spanners to undo the bolt that holds the TBM in the towbar, and swap the tow ball mounts over fairly easily.

Cheers,
Kevin

[404pug Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close 404pug]

NO slipper springs! They will come out on corrugations although I have seen chain welded to them to stop this. On my offroad trailer I have mechanical overide brakes and electric brakes [allows a handbrake as well-vital if you unhitch on a slope.] Also if you plan any dirt work get shocks on the trailer. I have a normal hitch and did the whole Old Telegraph Track to the Cape with it. If you dont yet have the trailer it is much cheaper to get the right stuff from the word go-brakes, off road hitch, military eye to eye springs, shocks, 45 mm axle from word go to give you freedom to develop it all later as needed. Neil

[D4D Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close D4D]

Electric brakes and for your use Hyland hitch. People bag the Hyland but they're ok and prevent ball swapping. I have a DO35 and I bought an extra hitch cheap from Toyota.

http://myswag.org/forum/index.php?topic=17357

[McBAIN Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close McBAIN]

Thanks for the responses all.

Matt

[Richoson Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Richoson]

Hi McBain

I worked at a trailer manufacturing company for several years (we made the chassis for Kedron Caravans) and the simple answer is start with the best you can afford.

Electric Brakes, make sure the chassis goes back to the spring hangers, independant suspension if you can afford it otherwise rebound shackle springs, Hyland hitch is great as well, 2t square axle, parallel bearings (beware of trailer bearings as most are really cheap and how many times have you seen the boat or box trailer on the side of the road with a wheel missing).

Couple of things as well, you will need to consider the height of the sides for the camper top. Also again if you can afford it hot dip galvanising, very expensive probably around $800.00 but my trailer is 10 years old sits in the rain with all sorts of rubbish until full and not a spec of rust, LED lights. Make sure that the floor is sealed correctly, you don't want dust and water in there. Also ask about having the tailgate made so that automotive pinch weld can be used as the seal (this is the stuff used on car doors).

The company I was with built lots of custom set ups such as this and I wouldn' expect you to get away with a quality build for under $1800.00 plus galvanising if you choose that.

See ya on the tracks, Richo.

[iantz Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close iantz]

It isn't always the case that changing the coupling is a 'major' job. It all depends on whether they weld or bolt the coupling on. If you wanted to go with standard coupling for now, I'd tell them to bolt it on, then late it is an easy bolt off job, add the new coupling and get it welded. If the cost is reasonable, say 200 or so dollars, then I would say do it now.

In regards to brakes, having towed boats with mechanical brakes I can honestly say they are a pain in the arse. They are ok if adjusted properly, but they don't stay that way for long - especially with boats that get tipped in and out of salt water. As for upgrading later, it actually isn't really that hard of a job. If you can change a wheel bearing (piece of cake) you can put electric drum brakes on. Even if you can't wire it, you can put them on and get an auto elec to do the wiring. But as I said, as for putting the new hubs on it is a piece of piss unless they are using an odd sized axle.

Just my 2 cents...

[chester ver 2.0 Member Find all posts View Profile Close chester ver 2.0]

Mate go the hyland reason being you dont have to be dead on and it will drop on the ball like a conventional hitch. I found the tregg hits drove me and the missus mad as it had to be spot on. This becomes more of an issue the heavier trailer you go as you cant just pull it into place if you are not lined up correctly.

[mjrandom Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close mjrandom]

McBain I run a Treg on our 6x4 trailer. No brakes (it's too small to warrant them) and have no problems. I built my trailer and have 500mm sides and decent clearance. The trailer is pretty much sheet metal and pressed steel so a monocoque design rather than separate chassis. Very light (200kg with spare) and very stiff. I have a canopy frame on top as well. Leaf springs and shockies. 1000kg axle with same track as the rear of the Prado and GX steelies now with the same BFGs. Tyres now are probably too aggressive for the trailer especially on sand but gives me a total of 5 spares all 275/65s. I occasionally have to swap the treg for a ball to tow other trailers and it is no big deal. Lining up the trailer is also no big deal but I can imagine doing so with a caravan or heavy trailer might be an issue. If you want to play with a Treg hitch let me know and I will make arrangments to catch up.

The Treg interferes with the rear sensors but then so does air!





I am able to carry all our camping gear in the trailer including a 6x4.5 gazebo so it is big enough with the taller sides. I am making a rack (this weekend) to sit over the canopy to carry 3 kayaks for our next trip to the Fraser Coast later this month.

Another handy thing to do is put a tarp in the trailer and then slowly fill it with water and measure the clearance between the top of the tyre and the guard. You can then plot a little graph so you know what weight you have behind you.

[fishfinder Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close fishfinder]

electric brakes with a redarc controller and as far as the hitch goes I have a Trigg bolted to one reece hitch and a ball bolted to another reece hitch so no spanners just pull the pin slide off the hitch and slide in the other hitch murphys law is when you need to swap the ball over it is always raining so might as well make it a simple quick swap over and as far as people borrowing my trailers I just wire the car and trailer only to suit my car so I tell people no probs take it go hook it up and tell them their wiring is stuffed as it works fine on my vehicles sorry mate not insured with faulty lights best ask some one else