Hydrogen Cells

[Ninpo04 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ninpo04]

G'day guys,

Has anyone researched into hydrogen cells in both diesel / petrol prados? I know a guy who has a hydrogen cell running on a 90 serious T/D and on a VR V6 Commodore.... very simple set up, no real ongoing costs and it's meant to increase performance.

If anyone is interested I can get some details and post them up of designs etc...

I'd like to hear people's thoughts on Hydrogen - you obviously can't run your 4x4 on it - but the cells are meant to give performance gains.

Cheers

[Guest Close Guest]

I think this is an excellent topic and for one would be very interested in seeing more info/images etc.

[Ninpo04 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ninpo04]

Photos as requested in a T/D 90 series...

[sparksy Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close sparksy]

I saw recently on today tonight there were two young blokes who had converted their XD falcon to run on the hydrogen/oxygen mix from one of these cell and they were getting great fuel economy.

[MickL Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close MickL]

:roll:

http://www.fuelsaving.info/hydrogen.htm


Mick

[Ninpo04 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ninpo04]

Haha where's the summary Mick?! Or do we have to read it all for ourselves...haha :lol:

[MickL Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close MickL]

In a nut shell... show us the before and after dyno sheets :lol: :lol:

I did find a mob in the US making an off the shelf kit which looked a bit better than a glass jar!

From what I've read I'm skeptical (VERY) but interested in what others think/ have to say. I’d like to see some dyno sheets or more scientific testing.


Mick

[Ninpo04 Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ninpo04]

Mmm so would I. Anyone got a dyno hanging around and a spare truck to play with?

[LenGXV6 Member Find all posts View Profile Close LenGXV6]

Browns Gas

Hi all

Having done some invesigations into this a little time ago, I would be very Skeptical about the claims of increased fuel economy, almost all of the devices that can be found on the net have been shown to do little if nothing.

That being said, there are scientist currently looking in this type of system to see if they can make it viable, the problem is getting the system to produce enough gas to make it work, the systems on the net do not, and can not produce the required amount of hydrogen/oxygen mixture quickly enough, and those that can, use a lot of water and alot of power from the battery/electrical system.

Will however be keeping an eye on the progress, after all, some bright cookie may just find a way to make this work.

[IRON-PAWW Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close IRON-PAWW]

Interesting topic.

While I don't know about the system used here I know some facts in general. The problem with hydrogen is firstly storing it, and secondly producing enough hydrogen for use in cars. The energy inputs and costs required to produce hydrogen in quantity are significant, which instantly negates any benefit you'd get from the clean running of a hydrogen only engine. I did read reports however that algae farms were being developed which gave off hydrogen as a by product. The hydrogen can then be collected for further use. Interestingly, I haven't heard anything further about this. I know that the hydrogen buses here in Perth no longer operate due to the sheer cost of keeping them on the road. Apart from that I believe they went very well and were zooming around Perth bus routes for a few years. You could spot them easily because they emitted a lot of water vapor through an exhaust stack on top of the bus. Water was their only emission though!

Apparently, hydrogen will actually "leak" from steel storage cylinders. A little hazy on this but it had something to do with the gas at a molecular level. Basically the gas molecules were small enough to seep through steel, or something like that. I saw on TV a while back that the problem of storage has possibly been solved by the use of carbon nanotubes which have only just recently been developed. Basically, you can build a kind of "sponge" out of the nanotubes. The incredibly small spaces in the nanotube sponge can "trap" the hydrogen in place. So a sort of storage container could feasibly be developed. Trouble was at the time, how to get it out again.

All good stuff though....

[plucker Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close plucker]

Hydrogen power is by no means new and obviously hasn't been considered because the almight fuel companies might lose some profits.

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc84 ... arinfo.jpg

[Bear Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Bear]

As i recall from my studies as a youth, the science of hydrogen from water is fairly simple. If a couple of electrodes are placed in water and then an electrical current is passed through the water, the electrons (electricity) causes the water molecules H20 to disassociate into positively and negatively charged ions. The negatively charged ions (the oxygen) is attracted to the Cathode (positive terminal) - and if the cathode is a metal such as zinc, it will react and produce zinc oxide - releasing the hydrogen as a gas. Something like that.

If fed into to the motor, the hydrogen then reacts with oxygen (burns), producing energy plus water ... hmmmm, if the flow rate of electricity through water was high enough, it just might produce enough H2 to be of value. But then you have to take into account the energy required to drive the alternator, the cost of the anode and cathode ... Could be worth a look i reckon! If someone had the technical skill to build one of these, i would consider testing it. Can't see any risk to the prado ... hydrogen is the cleanest of all fuels.

Can any of the mechanics tell us whether there is unutilised electricity already being produced by the alternator?

Good one Ninpo, just had scroll down and saw your piccies. I have my doubts as to how much hydrogen can be produced by this system ... but it sure warrants investigation imo.

[Hutch Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close Hutch]

http://digiads.com.au/car-news/latest-B ... 00804.html

A right up about the hydrogen BMW.

[Bear Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Bear]

Hey, there is a mass of stuff on the net.

Here is one simple system: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNuExC8kVKE

[Bear Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Bear]

Hutch, that BMW has a hydrogen tank. What Ninpo is referring to is an under bonnet system for on the spot production of hydrogen.

The theory is fine. However, the more i think about it the less possible it seems to produce any significant amount of H2. Even if we could release all the hydrogen from a bucket of water, the energy produced would still be much less than that produced from a bucket of petrol. From the look of the under bonnet systems, there is only a little bit of gas being produced - relative to the consumption of our motors.

Saw one web site where some fellow is demanding over two thousand for a system ... skam :evil: