Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

[lyonsy Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close lyonsy]

Hi all,
Very interested to know opinions of these exhaust filled bull bags, I would like to keep the weight down, hence I feel the bull bag would be better than the hi-lift jacl, any pros and cons would be very much appreciated. My major concern would be punctures, I understand I would have to avoid any sharp objects etc. I dont know if this would be a problem, I'm thinking not they are more expensive so therefore I dont want to blow my money. Any opinions would be appreciated.
Thanks
Lyonsy

[Prado BB Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Prado BB]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

lysony
I've used both on my old patrol and would suggest the following:

Pros

Airbag - easy to use (in sand and level ground), less effort involved, less weight, good to use as an everyday jack (tyre rotation)
Hi-lift - multi-uses (jack, winch, stabiliser), used in tight situations (fire trails where it may be hard to use air bag)
Cons

Airbag - you have to get under car, not so good in rocky or uneven terrain, less control (tends to lift whole side), can get messy in mud
Hi-lift - need correct lifting points on car, weight, storage in/on car, tend to jamb alot, can be hard to jack (need big muscles)

Cheers, Andy

[FlyingBushPig Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close FlyingBushPig]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

Hi all,
My major concern would be punctures, I understand I would have to avoid any sharp objects etc.

I've used both, but only own a hi-lift - simple reason as you have stated.

bullbag= great in sand, nothing will beat it (other than maxtrax maybe )

hi-lift = fine in sand, great in mud, on rocks, in the middle of a river (bad scenario of course) or basically anywhere else you can think of to take your Prado!

[Bushbasher Out of control poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Bushbasher]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

The downside to both is that they lift the body resulting in the suspension hanging down. You have to lift the vehicle a long way before getting the wheels up. The airbag is pretty tricky but once you get the hang of it is fairly easy to use. You generally need one person on the throttle and one person holding the end against the exhaust pipe. If you get some decent rubber mats you can avoid punctures. The supplied mats are usually a little on the thin side. In sand, the bag needs to be placed into a bit of a hole to secure it and prevent sideways movement upon inflation. The bag is capable of lifting the body at least half a metre and can lift the whole rear, or whole front or one full side if placed appropriately.

Kangaroo jacks need a firm base plate and also require the appropriate matching slots in the bull bar or rear tow bar/reece hitch. You can get special hooks that allow the unit to lift at the wheel. OK for steel wheels, haven't seen it for the alloys though. You can also slot the tongue into the reece towbar slot on some cars. Lifting the axle gains more clearance for less lift than just lifting the body because of the suspension hang down. 'Roo jacks shouldn't be used for changing tyres. Generally we wouldn't use the 'roo jack in sand.

They both have their uses, pros and cons. Obviously the air bag weighs heaps less and takes up less space. "roo jacks look wanky hanging off spare tyres or roof racks. They seize up with dust & rust so you also need a can of CRC and I would advise you to put the thing in a bag to minimise the dirt problem.

[FlyingBushPig Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close FlyingBushPig]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

You can get special hooks that allow the unit to lift at the wheel. OK for steel wheels, haven't seen it for the alloys though.

I have one of these as I don't have a bar at all - called a lift-mate. Works brilliantly. I don't think I'd use a bar for jacking now if I had one (used to on my old cruiser). Lifting the wheel straight up is just so perfect and quick.

Years ago we used to jack the whole vehicle up off the bar then simply push the whole vehicle over - very effective but I really wouldn't do it unless you REALLY know what you're doing. Could be VERY dangerous in the wrong circumstance.

I had a mate who had a Hi-lift brand jack and it died (jamned) very quickly (2 years or so). I bought a "Jackall" which was the biggest available at the time. I've only ever put WD40 on it occasionally and it's never missed a beat. I've now had it 11 years. Many tent making places will do a canvas bag for them, I should get one some time.

[flyingwil Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close flyingwil]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

Agreed on the Hi-Lift. Here in the states we mainly use a Hi-Lift, there is so many uses for recover that one can do with a Hi-Lift in comparison to the AirJacks. One of the things that shocked me was the lack of Hi-Lifts at the PPGTG.

Here in the US, our rigs seem to be built up a bit differently, with as much protection as possible. Basically all the protection, or armor was we call it, creates an jacking point.
Here is my Tacoma, and as you can see I can use the Hi-Lift on any side of the vehicle to suit the conditions required for the proper recovery. The sides have rock rails, which can support the weight of the vehicle, the custom rear bumper can be jacked anywhere, and the front can be jacked using an Twisted D shackle.


As mentioned above, there is many Hi-Lift accessories that can aid in certain situations. In mud and sand the off road base is a must, the Lift-Mate allows you to lift the vehicle from the wheels and not have your suspension droop, and the bumper lift allows for you to attach it to your bumpers if you have curved bumpers.

I have used the Bushranger X-Jack, and found that it was useless unless lift from directly under the axle due to the flex in the suspension not lifting the wheel off the ground. We also encountered issues with the cheaper versions popping or being cut causing rapid deflation. I only take my air jack out when I am going to be in heavily sandy areas, but that doesn't mean I am leaving my Hi-Lift at home.

Another good thing about the Hi-Lift is that if you picked the wrong line, and are in a position where you can not back up to get situated on the proper line, you can use it to move the vehicle to one side or another. With the Air jack you are limited to which direction gravity will take your vehicle in an off camber situation, speaking of that is another con to the air jacks as the bag tends to shift to one side or the other.

[LostDingo2 Find all posts View Profile Close LostDingo2]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

Good topic....I have had interest in both but have leaned toward the Hi-Lift. The biggest issue is where I can connect the thing without creating damage ect.

I am aware the the straps to connect to the wheels but without sounding stupid......how do you change the tire then :shock:

Flyingwil.....what type of tread on the Tacoma :?:

[FlyingBushPig Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close FlyingBushPig]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

......how do you change the tire then :shock:

i think it was mentioned earlier but you should never use a hi-lift to change a tyre. Was never meant for that purpose and the sideways movement as you pull the wheel off the hub could be enough to topple the jack over - not nice when you're right down in perfect position to get squashed by the vehicle. A good bottle jack and decent base plate is the only thing to be used for that purpose.

[LostDingo2 Find all posts View Profile Close LostDingo2]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

I had thought maybe carrying a Hi-Lift and jack stand may be a good option

[flyingwil Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close flyingwil]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

Good topic....I have had interest in both but have leaned toward the Hi-Lift. The biggest issue is where I can connect the thing without creating damage ect.

That's where some thinking comes into play. Look at the accessories, and make sure that you know how to use it before using it your first time. The Hi-Lift can be very dangerous if not used properly, or the jack is not properly maintained.

I am aware the the straps to connect to the wheels but without sounding stupid......how do you change the tire then :shock:

Flyingwil.....what type of tread on the Tacoma :?:

Those were the old 255/85R16 BFG MT KM. They have recently changed the tread here to KM2's. I am now running Toyo Open Country MT's and love 'em.

[getaway ray Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close getaway ray]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

Hi-Lift jacks have been mentioned in other threads in this forum but the biggest problem is they are dammed dangerous. The 4WD club I am a member of does not condone Hi-Lift jacks at all. Without proper fitting points on the vehicle they can easily do damage to your car,and are never to be used to change a tyre.

[MickL Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close MickL]

Re: Bullbag vs hi-lift jack

but the biggest problem is they are dammed dangerous

It's not the Hi Lift Jack that's dangerous.... :wink: it's the same with winching and snatch recovery. They are all dangerous at the hands of the un-trained or incompetent.

Mick